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November 09, 2013 00:25

Dick,

OK, be unique!

Example! Nedelrand Kon. Beatrix 39c design Peter Struycken. Whichever catalog you pick, you will only find 1 stamp!

What most collectors don't know is that there are 3 different 39c stamps! Issued in resp. 2002, 2003 and 2006.

All 3 stamps deserve their own catalog number!

Let CataWikiPZ be the first to take care of that ????

Greetings, Rein

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November 09, 2013 00:37

Hi Rein, correct example, I have no knowledge of stamps

but if there are 3 variants of that stamp, in my opinion they are 3 items and whether another catalog denies that or another club does not know or denies the existence of that will be a sausage to me

example I believe I have about 7 all you need is love singles Dutch in different versions the music is the same but the layout differs so 7 items

If that stamp has 3 versions then 3 items and maybe the postage value (music) is the same, I have no idea!

only you will have to place those stamps with your own scan to verify their existence

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November 09, 2013 01:47

What most collectors don't know is that there are 3 different 39c stamps!

I only find two: 370913 and 855539 (both from 2002?).

The second is a perforation variety with apparently "normal perforation", but what kind of abnormal perforation the first has is not mentioned. Can't be seen on the scans either, because they are completely identical.

I don't really care about stamps anymore, but if I were manager there, something like that would bother me.

(Sorry Sinbad, bit off topic.)

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November 09, 2013 07:52

@Rein.

As I wrote before, you know better or you have more knowledge.

Fortunately, you let us share this by regularly submitting this knowledge. in Catawiki so that the unknowing collectors can also benefit from this.

Let CataWikiPZ be the first to take care of this ????

Yes, please and thank you Rein.

The stamp managers have made an agreement on how to solve this problem, but they have not heard from the Catawiki programmers for the past 9 months. (Despite memories) (But the birth will not be long in coming anyway). The other sections can also take advantage of this if it works.

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November 09, 2013 10:14

Nice that everyone here is going crazy, I appreciate that

But 10 days ago I asked a very fair and fair question to the administrators.

Why is our Dutch ( ex-) colony Suriname divided into 2 separate countries and all other (ex-) colonials of the other European countries have remained 1 country.

But I do not get an answer to this simple and clear question.

So we can have fun with anyone, even administrators of other departments for a long time, but as is now an old tradition, nothing befits the administrators of stamps.

The administrators have made Suriname a double country as an exception to the rest of the world, they are the only ones who can tell me why they did that,

Nobody here in the discussion has made Suriname 2 countries, we can hours of fun clapping here, I don't get an answer to this inconsuquent decision.

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November 09, 2013 11:49

After about ten days you should indeed have received an answer from an administrator, I think. Have they not seen this thread? Have you tried poking through an admin profile yet? That sometimes helps.

As far as I can see, those two Surinamese have existed side by side since the start of the section, namely through an import from Collectarom. So the question is not so much why it was done, as whether they should not have been merged and yes: why not?

If I'm wrong, I'd like to hear about it.

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November 09, 2013 12:20

What most collectors don't know is that there are 3 different 39c stamps! Issued in resp. 2002, 2003 and 2006.

That's nice to know, Rein. How can we tell the difference?

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November 09, 2013 14:37

Indeed Arco, these 2 Surinamese are part of the collect-a-rom import from years ago. None of the current administrators have had any influence on this.

Definitely a good point why these are included separately. This is one of the many things we still need to consider. We just haven't gotten around to it yet.

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November 09, 2013 18:43

We just haven't gotten to it yet.

Okay, glad that after almost 2 weeks and the necessary coercion, an administrator finally responds when a user draws their attention to this strange Catawiki fact

With a bit of luck it will now be adjusted in 3 years

Indeed Arco, these 2 Surinamese are part of the collect-a-rom import from years ago.

Okay and you now admit that Catawiki is indeed just a retyped collect-a-rom that is another bad copy of the NVPH guide, something that has been claimed here for years by various users and firmly denied. and we are therefore not (yet) a new catalog of our own

Perhaps an idea to bring in some philatelic heavyweights for sincere advice and to listen to it?

Just an idea whispered to me to make up for 5 years of stagnation and decline

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November 09, 2013 20:32

Sinbad,

you are clear. Suriname has to become 1 country again and all stamps belong together regardless of whether the stamps were ordered from Nedelrand or by Hugo van Reijen {Channel Islands] or by Dino Bouterse ...

Why the administrators have ever done this is no longer so fascinating! Unless you're interested in the inscrutability of the trusteeship ?!

Just carry on that trade. Don't hide behind programmers or anyone else!

greetings, Rein

P.S.

The off-topic Bea 39c is now on its own!

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November 09, 2013 21:54

Sinbad, nobody forced me to respond.

I will let the rest of the nonsense you write pass me by.

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November 10, 2013 00:33

Look Sinbad, that's exactly why administrators don't respond to your comments. Every response, however substantive, is answered with a sneer and often unfounded criticism. Just to caress your own ego and grab the chance to make quasi nice comments. Always trying to have the last word.

Unfortunately, this sometimes fades your justified criticism into the background and the discussions get bogged down in rubbish. After all this time I would have rated you a bit higher.

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November 10, 2013 09:51

You can ask a normal question here and then wait weeks for an answer.

Apparently that is normal and meets the civilized standard here.

Then why can I and other annoying users Have you been discussing normally with the many non-stamp managers on the forum for years? Are we really talking about my ego?

That you blame me that administrators do not want to respond, you try to caress my ego.

Who and what I am for an annoying nobody I already know that, so caressing my own Ego here is the last thing I need, but there are a few here who should have a little less ego.

But shit fine over Sinbad, I shit back

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November 10, 2013 10:10

@Sinbad last comment absolutely unnecessary but you have indeed asked a normal question and stamp management is getting no further than yes that is a thing of the past!

and only x number of days after others have also been surprised pronounced

What amazes me that people are always played on the man why?

And have thick long toes.

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November 10, 2013 10:20

What amazes me is that the man is always played on why?

It is like a wave movement at Postzegels, it goes well for a while and then all emotions are released on the forum.

Can questions be asked and answers given within a reasonable timeframe, without mentioning all kinds of reproaches?

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November 10, 2013 10:24

Can questions be asked and answers given within a reasonable period of time, without mentioning all kinds of reproaches?

Chicken egg problem!

Not answering within a reasonable time leads to sharp remarks and these are a good excuse not to answer questions or to label the questions as not useful ....

And so the CWPZ world turns on ! And as Sinbad says, we will be 5 years further in no time without any progress!

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November 10, 2013 11:02

@reinbakhuizenvdbrink
Chicken egg problem!

No, a matter of decency.

  • Asking questions without blaming / innuendo
  • Respond promptly and without blame / innuendo
  • In the absence of a response, also remain decent
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November 10, 2013 11:43

The stamp handbook only says to choose an area from the dropdown.

What is (still) missing is a set of rules on the basis of which you should choose a certain country\area. And because there are no rules, problems arise.

I've been thinking about this for a while and I think the bottom line is that there is a difference between where a stamp is issued and who the stamp is issued by . This is not a problem with a Bea39c, because the answer is the Netherlands in both cases.

But that is a problem with many stamps. The fact that this distinction is not recognized in the current catalog, and that many existing catalogs lump these things together and then (on variable political grounds) choose one over the other is, I think, the crux. We have to develop an unambiguous structure within the Catawiki stamp catalog that collectors can use.

A 1938 Indonesian stamp and a 1958 Indonesian stamp may have both been issued in Indonesia. But you can say that only the 1958 copy was issued by Indonesia. The stamp from 1938 was not issued by Indonesia, it was actually issued by the Netherlands. And what about the seals I understand the insurgents used in the transition period. They have also been published in Indonesia :-), but the hot potato is by whom . Some will say, "by nobody, these stamps don't exist". But that is a point of view that you cannot use from a collector's point of view, and that is what Catawiki is all about, of course. Users just have those things in their folders, so they exist.

Or the stamps that were used here in the Netherlands between 1940 and 1945. Published in the Netherlands, published by the Netherlands.? At that time, the Netherlands actually did not even exist from a constitutional point of view. The correct answer is probably "issued by Germany in the area that was the state of the Netherlands until May 5, 1940"

Or to make it even more difficult. I know that a certain E. Rommel had 'already' stamps made for occupied North Africa during the war. However, he was kicked out of the area before he had a chance to use them. Are those stamps? For the collector, at least one hundred percent sure it is. But which 'country\area' does that fall under, and why?

So there must be clear rules for this. Catawiki rules that is. Can't say what other catalogs think of it. That is irrelevant, if only because they apparently cannot agree on anything either.

And to top it off, those rules should include cinderellas. There, too, it is now a problem to link it to an area.

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November 10, 2013 12:38

Pegag,

and here we go again! CataWiki well-intentioners are reinventing philately!

When a few real philatelists - provided they feel like it and have the time - to sit down and agree on what characteristics should be defined in order to to be able to determine what a philatelic item looks like !!

CWPZ was probably devised by Erik Boere, who thought he had poured out the cement foundation with Collect-A-Rom with color look-up jokes that no philatelist likes to wait. Not to mention the theme knitting.

The basis for a classification - see the Postage Stamps manual - is a sand swamp that you can do nothing with. A few aspects make sense, the rest are not. The choices per facet are arbitrary and incoherent. You have to make a choice knowing that it is worth nines. For example, CWPZ is crammed with inaccurate and incorrect data to which others are forced to hang their collection and store. It is not possible to correct afterwards because then the shop will collapse .....

I wrote extensively about this in an earlier incarnation, which I was not appreciated by the CW leadership.

The Stamps Handbook must be overhauled!

So there must be unambiguous rules. Catawiki rules that is. Can't bomb what other catalogs think. That is irrelevant, if only because they apparently cannot agree on anything.

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November 10, 2013 12:48

Or the stamps used here in the Netherlands between 1940 and 1945. Published in the Netherlands, published by the Netherlands.?

Is such a question ever asked in the comic books of Mr Bommel / Marten Toonder ??? Whether the gramophone records of Marlene Diettrich ???

Nedelrand is NL, or whether Colijn ruled there or Mussert, Drees or Wilders .. stamps issued in the South NL in 1944 are stamps from NL, stamps issued by the NL -marine in exile are stamps from NL!

Stamps of Indonesia Pemoeda Merdeka are issued by a postal service that existed NEXT to that of the KNIL ... The stamps of Nederlandsch Indie and Indonesia [from 1948 the official name] form ONE continuous whole. Within the issue of 1949 Cipher and Temple there is NO separation to be made, so don't try that! Anyone who is brainwashed with the ideas of the NVPH and Michel will have problems with that, but what can the CWPZ bombs ...;)

The same applies to Suriname! Whether with Desiderius or Dinosaurus B ...

greetings, Rein

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November 10, 2013 12:53

and here we go again! CataWiki well-intentioners are reinventing philately!

I don't get this sentence. And if I have to understand it as I read it, I don't like it.

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November 10, 2013 13:03

If you turn the Country / Territory field into a multiple field, I believe we are finally over from this endless discussion.

A seal from during the German occupation of the Netherlands you can, for example, give the following Countries / Areas depending on the angle:

- The Netherlands (the colony)

- The Netherlands (Occupation 1940-1945)

- Germany (the colonizer)

In the case of a Cinderella:

- Maluku Setan

- Cinderella

In digital catalog like Catawiki this no problem. In a paper catalog you were more or less obliged to hang an item on 1 specific coat rack.

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November 10, 2013 13:15

Is such a question ever asked in the comic books of Mr Bommel / Marten Toonder ??? Or the gramophone records of Marlene Diettrich ???

Readers of Marten Toonder and listeners of Marlene do not beat each other's brains because 'their' catalog says so or so. Collectors from Indonesia do, because they and their catalogs cannot or will not agree on who was boss where and when, and that seems to be very important when issuing stamps.

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November 10, 2013 13:37

Boy, boy, what is being played to the man here!

Sinbad asks a common question and soon the discussion bogged down in another discussion played out on the man! I thought that things like that were blocked by a moderator if you deviated too much from the topic?

So to the point:

That's nice to write with the background information , but otherwise no reason to mention the same country twice ... right?

I think that is a great solution for the multi-country problem, because Suriname is probably not the only country that has multiple owners / overlords / administrators. Write the history with the background information and keep it on 1 country. Use aliases (is this also possible with Stamps), then you can enter something, but then it will always end up at 1 country. And yes, it is a pull-down menu, so you cannot enter anything, then choose the 1 name solution.

I also think Martinel's solution is a very nice and clear one, but for the overview it is nice that it can all be shown together. Let the programmers quickly make a choice option. If I were to collect Indonesia (I do have some Maluku Selatan or Papua New Guinea, but I think these are other countries), I would like to have the stamps and postage stamps from all times, in various denominations.

What could also be possible is an aforementioned solution by mentioning several countries. At Postcards, for example, I have maps from the Haute-Savoie region, which have been in the possession of several countries throughout history (due to nobility through inheritance or annexation, as most Savoyards still see it). Fortunately you can enter several countries there and I think for that reason.

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November 10, 2013 15:31

How many Catalog Administrators vent their opinion to Philatelists here????

In short, the KNSU knows better than Sven Kramer how to skate, because they determine the rules...

Regards, Rein

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